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Old 03-29-2016, 07:59 AM
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Anyone following this news debacle? Andrew Wakefield, who has not only been shown to be a fraud, a liar, and an opportunist, but is also a thoroughly discredited physician who had his medical licensed pulled after his unethical and manipulated "study" told the world that the MMR vaccine causes autism has now written, directed, and starred in a movie. Problem with that revelation, of course, is that the MMR vaccine does NOT cause autism, there is no causation NOR correlation between receiving the vaccine and development of the symptoms of autism. But never mind the facts. Let's let this crazed loon make a MOVIE about his lies....and create yet ANOTHER generation of parents fearful the The Boogeyman Vaccine: you know, the one that makes your kids autistic.

It's disgusting, and I am SO glad that Tribeca is not giving it a minute of screening time. I know Robert DeNiro has a child with autism, and I also know he supports vaccination. It was nice that he originally felt that showing the movie would "allow all sides a voice", but the stark reality is that there IS no other "side" to this situation! Vaccines do not cause autism. Vaccines do not cause autism. Vaccines do not....you get it. Why can't those anti-vax Crusaders Against Scientific Knowledge get it???

Grrrrr.....obviously this pushes my buttons. I swear, Wakefield and his two cohorts in crime (because, I believe, his "study" WAS criminal in how it harmed so many people!!) should never be allowed to speak in public again, let alone make a FILM that continues the lies!

SOOOO pissed off right now.....
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Old 03-29-2016, 12:36 PM
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WEll, DUH!! Autism is something you get born with; I'm speaking from a position of authority here, having just been diagnosed as being on the spectrum. Since I've been told ad nauseam that I've always been the way I am, I guess we can say that it didn't crop up because I was one of the kids who tested the Salk polio vaccine, now, can we?
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Old 03-29-2016, 12:54 PM
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And yet there are throngs of people who firmly believe that a child who is "perfectly normal" and then exhibits the signs of autism after having received the MMR vaccine is, obviously, "injured" from having received the vaccine. The fact that the most obvious symptoms tend to present at about he time the child is scheduled for the vaccination is something the anti-vax idiots seem to ignore. Oh no....the only way that kid "got autism" was because of the shot: he was fine one minute, autistic the next, dontchaknow??

I guess I can speak from a position of authority (whatever that is, LOL) as the PARENT of an autistic young man who exhibited the early signs of autism BEFORE he ever received his first MMR. BEFORE any question could be raised as to whether he was 'vaccine injured'. Had he been our first child....had I NOT been a La Leche League Leader (and therefore around children ALL the time with monthly meetings and home visits) perhaps I would not have recognized those early signs as trouble. I might have let them slide as "he's just a late bloomer" or something like that. I might have let family that insisted I was "pushing him too hard, he'll develop in his own time" override my gut sense that said something was wrong. But it was all of the above that made me investigate further, get him in front of professionals who knew what they were LOOKING at, and get the dx he/we needed to get him into Early Intervention services. Other families, for whom such knowledge wasn't available, parents who didn't recognize the problems or even accept them if they SAW them....well, it's easy to blame the vaccine. Doesn't make it so, however.

The "duh" part of your post assumes that people know and understand all this, but unfortunately there are people who prefer to believe that there are mass conspiracies....governmental cover-ups....Big Pharma plots to take over the world.....and they get air time through crap like this.

Andrew Wakefield singlehandedly did more to undermine the vaccination-compliance rate than anything else in history, I do believe. Making parents frightened that if they immunized their child against deadly diseases that would "make them autistic"...it's just horrendously irresponsible on his behalf.

I suppose, though, that he BELIEVES the crap he spews, so "it's ok". His "research" is pure crap; he lost his license to practice because of unethical activities and intentionally skewed "research".

I keep putting "research" in quotes where Wakefield is concerned because it's all nonsensical non-science crapola as far as I can tell!
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Old 03-29-2016, 03:53 PM
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When vaccines in general came out, there were people (perhaps the very ancestors of today's nay-sayers) who spread panic by insisting that vaccines were "poison" because they came from the very diseases they were supposed to prevent not to mention that they were made in the blood of animals. It's probably safe to say that a lot of people fear not only change but anything to do with disease (even if it's designed to prevent it) and when rabid ignorance is added, that's where the trouble starts.

It's a damned pity that nobody can create something to protect against that.
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Old 03-29-2016, 06:21 PM
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I plan on seeing it, of course, so I can LMAO!
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Old 03-30-2016, 06:32 AM
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Originally Posted by Farawyn View Post
I plan on seeing it, of course, so I can LMAO!
I wouldn't pay a dime to see it, or do anything that would elevate the "popularity" of the film. Not a chance. It's going to be dangerous ENOUGH to people who are unable to protect themselves....meaning, children who have parents who are gullible.....so I'm not going to add to that.

I met a woman whose child was also autistic; he was fully grown at the time and my son was still quite young, so it was gratifying to know that much had been done in the way of behavioral modifications and teaching styles since then.....when she had to fight constantly with the school because her son simply wouldn't sit there and take notes and do his classwork "like the other kids". Yeahhh...

Anyway, it was also shocking to me to learn that she had been labeled a "Refrigerator Mom" because it was OBVIOUS to the medical and educational community that her son was so distant and difficult to 'reach' because she OBVIOUSLY had neglected him as a babe, and disregarded his needs as a small child. It was HER COLDNESS that made him autistic. OMG, how horrifying is THAT?!

And now we have vaccinations that are about as connected to autism as "cold mothers", but we STILL have to fight that crapola off.
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Old 03-30-2016, 03:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoreDilaudidPlease! View Post
I wouldn't pay a dime to see it, or do anything that would elevate the "popularity" of the film. Not a chance. It's going to be dangerous ENOUGH to people who are unable to protect themselves....meaning, children who have parents who are gullible.....so I'm not going to add to that.

I met a woman whose child was also autistic; he was fully grown at the time and my son was still quite young, so it was gratifying to know that much had been done in the way of behavioral modifications and teaching styles since then.....when she had to fight constantly with the school because her son simply wouldn't sit there and take notes and do his classwork "like the other kids". Yeahhh...

Anyway, it was also shocking to me to learn that she had been labeled a "Refrigerator Mom" because it was OBVIOUS to the medical and educational community that her son was so distant and difficult to 'reach' because she OBVIOUSLY had neglected him as a babe, and disregarded his needs as a small child. It was HER COLDNESS that made him autistic. OMG, how horrifying is THAT?!

And now we have vaccinations that are about as connected to autism as "cold mothers", but we STILL have to fight that crapola off.
Nah, you're right. I won't pay to see it. But I am going to see it. So I can laugh.
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Old 03-30-2016, 04:40 PM
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I thought the idea of refrigerator mothers was debunked some time ago. Well, what can you expect from people who hold onto a Medieval mindset where vaccinations are concerned?
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Old 03-30-2016, 05:39 PM
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I am apologizing in advance if my post doesn't make sense. I pulled a double and my brain is still fuzzy...

Just a thought.... when this whole mess came to light there were many chilidren (those born 40's 50's 60's early 70's (maybe later) that had been vaccinated and how many had autism? I'm not sure of the numbers here... I do agree that the vaccines do NOT cause Autism.

MDP and Mim, you've experienced it first hand. I tip my (nurse's) cap to you. I know I could not handle your experiences. Hell, I can't even handle the thought of being pregnant....

I just don't/can't understand how people still buy into this idea that the vaccines cause autism after it's been proven that they don't....
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Old 03-31-2016, 09:49 AM
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Some people hold onto their beliefs regardless of the evidence to the contrary because they are scared to change their beliefs.....despite the evidence. Some people just have to be on the side of "the cause", whatever the cause, because they enjoy being outraged. As though that somehow makes them part of the elite few (even though they are not few, but you know what I mean) who are refusing the status quo. They insist that their "questioning" of the widely-accepted PROOF means that they are much more intelligent and much more cautious than us stupid lemmings, LOL....they are happiest railing against the mainstream, the norm.

Sometimes railing against the norm is simply stupid, because sometimes it is the norm BECAUSE it's true. I bet if we looked hard enough, we'd find some kind of movement whose members are against the concept of gravity. And that the Earth really IS flat. Idiocy.

Kylee.....the rate of diagnosis of autism spectrum disorder has most definitely increased, with or without vaccination. There is much research going on as to WHY, but for now, we don't have "it" with absolution. There is most definitely a genetic component; you are more likely to see autistics born to parents who are scientists, mathematicians, engineers. Family lines that carry the trait from one generation to the next. Increased awareness has no doubt increased the number of those now diagnosed at an earlier age, but that doesn't account for enough of it to make it something "that has always been that way" as opposed to something newly developing, in recent decades. SOMETHING is going on, no doubt. Identical twins have long been studied, and we STILL don't know why ONE of them will be autistic, and one will not. Identical genes...but SOMETHING happened differently even though they received their vaccinations at the same time....had the same diet...lived in the same house...went to the same playgrounds and schools and ate the same food/water. So...WHAT is it that created the difference? No one knows.

The Denmark study of 500,000 children something like 15 years ago was the largest, most conclusive study to date. It was done in a country with socialized healthcare so that everyone had the same opportunity for vaccination. And the results were that the vaccinated children and non-vaccinated children developed autism at the SAME RATE. Actually....while it's statistically insignificant.....the non-vaccinated group had a slightly HIGHER rate of autism. Not enough of a margin to conclude that vaccines PREVENT autism, LOL, but you get the idea. I'm sure if the data showed a statistically insignificant decrease of autism amongst the non-vaccinated, the headcase anti-vaccine brigade would declare that it's proof of vaccines causing the condition. But those of us who understand the scientific method know better ;-)

I really thought that study would put an end, once and for all, to the notion that the MMR vaccine carriers the risk of creating autism in an otherwise typical child. But alas.....nope. No, all evidence indicating this to be a false conclusion is waved away by those who KNOW it causes autism because Big Pharma is out to get everyone, the CDC is lying and covering things up, the WHO are in on it too....and all of them know someone (or several someones!) who were PERFECT the day before they got vaccinated and became a VEGETABLE---or autistic---or paralyzed--or DEAD--- the next day. Really?
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